Jerusalem - Tel Aviv-Yafo [Jaffa]‘s Chief Rabbi Yisrael Meir Lau says he was shocked to see a photograph of a Jewish boy wearing a yellow star in last week’s hareidi religious demonstration in the Jerusalem neighborhood of Mea Shearim.
Rabbi Lau told the Hebrew-language newspaper Ma’ariv in an interview that the hareidi public feels “persecuted,” but that this feeling “in my opinion leads it to express itself in a way that borders on blasphemy. If you explain to secular Jews observance of the Sabbath through hurling rocks and shouts of “Nazi!” then first of all, they [themselves] are sinning by touching the rock—which itself is forbidden on the Sabbath—and you also destroy the tiniest chance that those who do not observe the Sabbath might begin to do so.
“The picture of the beautiful and innocent Orthodox child at a demonstration, raising his hands in surrender, wearing on his garment a yellow star, chased the sleep from my eyes that night,” Rabbi Lau continued. “I am afraid for him, even for his faith. When this child will grow up and will realize what they did to him in his community, how they exploited his innocence, how they used him, he is likely to kick away the traditions of his father’s house.
“For me, to stand a child up with his hands raised in surrender in imitation of that famous photograph from the Warsaw Ghetto distorts history and shows incomparable ingratitude to the Master of the Universe, who gave us the Jewish State that did not exist when that original photo was taken,” he added. “The significance of the act is simply to ignore the kindness of the Creator Who tells you, you aren’t standing today before Nazis who are coming to destroy you. Today you have a country, you have a home, and the police are coming to defend every Jew, even if he demonstrates in the streets of Jerusalem.
“How can you compare Jews to a Nazi who was able to throw a baby into a frying pan on a burning Primus stove?” Rabbi Lau demanded. “And I am talking about things I saw with my own eyes. Or a Nazi who could take a child similar to the one who participated in that demonstration and tear him apart? Those who demonstrated “Nazis! Nazis!”—including the “price tag” demonstrators who attacked the IDF officers—don’t know what a Nazi monster is and to what depths he can reach.”
Rabbi Lau said he believes there should be deterrents and enforcement of the law when anyone uses symbols of the Holocaust. “Shouts of ‘Nazi’ at Jews—not to mention photos of things like that child—cause us, the survivors, insomnia and nightmares,” he said.
Source: Israel National News
Yea, but the parents using their children for this purpose, are not thinking of common decency when they use their children as props. They are as far removed from human decency being kadmah to the Torah as they can possible be. Shabbat and Shmittah take precedence over loving their fellow Jew. And for them decency is neither the basis or the goal of their observance. The secret of this problem lies with the loss of empathy. Much of this has to do with the inability of people who have learned to bury their pain to do so in order to survive. Suffering in Ashkenazic Jewish history is so deep and profound, that the tools to feel how much pain they are causing are completely buried because of long term brain stem damage because of the intensity of Jewish suffering for 1700 years in Xtian Europe. Generation after generation of Lara Logan style gang rapes on Jewish women result in the intense need to bury the pain in order to survive. So children raised in this environment were not loved for who they are by their mothers because the mothers themselves lack the tools to do so. And these adults take their brain stem damage into adulthood, and rather than develop their emotional health, they choose the world of Chumrot and intolerance for those who do not hold by their Chumrot. Welcome to the world of the Erev Ze'ir. I have no idea how G-d is going to penetrate with His love this world to soothe the seething tempest of profoundly deep mental illness wrought in the furnace of human suffering. This does not excuse human indecency, but it does explain it. And since modern psychology has very few tools to confront a profound illness of the human soul, the only one who will heal this is G-d Himself.
ReplyDeleteAnd do we make the same excuses for pedophiles? I hear what you're saying, but its a dangerous road to go down if you're going to make excuses for all types of unacceptable behaviour towards women and children.
ReplyDeleteMay Hashem the Ultimate Healer, heal the sick minds who thought up this
ReplyDeletehorrendous and lunatic idea...
Hashem yeracheim...
May Hashem guard his beloved Children
from any harm...and grant wisdom to those who [sorely] lack it..
BTW
How do these people do teshuva upon causing so much untold misery on those who have already gone thru the Abbys of Hell, and their descendants???
Rav Lau is completely correct. But of course this prohibition on the misuse of Holocaust imagery and terminology must include the ultra-left which for years has been calling anyone of whom they disapprove a nazi.
ReplyDeleteI had similar thoughts about the child in the picture. This is really a form of child abuse.
the prohibition on misuse of Holocaust imagery and terminology must also include the ultra-right which for years has been calling anyone of whom they disapprove a nazi; for example the term "feminnazi" coined by that "good friend" of the JEwish people Rush Limbaugh
ReplyDeletefeminazis and zionazi's Holocaust minimization both, right wing left wing Esau and Yishmael xtians and mslim "friends" . We the Jewish people have committed Holocaust minimization! It's useless to point your finger and say it's "them", those Haredi , it is us! We have committed Holocaust minimization! Best thing is to own it and make teshuvah and learn whatever it is HAshem wants us to learn.
ReplyDeletei agree with dov. though i am sure he too is not excusing this totally unacceptable behaviour, and opposite to the holy torah. this exile has dragged on too long. i agree with rabbi lau also. however, instead of only emphasising on the misbehaviour of a few, at the same time if he or others highlight the very very good things orthodox jewish families do and how they help others, expose the greater good of the greater number, it would also be a lesson to the few who are over zealous the wrong way.
ReplyDeleteThere is no justification for causing distress to a Rabbi and not even to ordinary people, but there is no justification either for the despicable attitude towards haredim, which some "orthodox" jews in israel make no effort to hide.
ReplyDeleteIt does not take a genius to figure out where that comes from. Hareidim are the only group in Israel who have a long-term view for the land and for its future and theirs - not MO, not israeli arabs, not chilonim, not russians, not foreign workers, not PA citizens, not anyone else. I do not like their view and I do not choose their way of life, however, much less do I like the hatred of all other groups, who, lacking an identity, are ready to do anything to get rid of the only group who does. May be we will have Moshiach, but if he is late, I do not want to be in Israel and see every day with my eyes, brothers be wolves to their brothers. When I see staged provocations, when I hear "modern orthodox" who talk about the haredim no different than Tommy Lapid (who, however, was not double-faced and was no hypocrite) then I have no doubt the Medinat is still galut. The Israeli prisons filled with fellow jews - many of them innocents - and in any case, that no one rushes to free, have sealed it for me.
Daniela: what do you mean, causing distress to a rabbi? which rabbi?
ReplyDeleteAnyway, I'm relieved to see this article at Israel National News where the women are reclaiming the streets of Beit Shemesh. And let me also add that I am relieved to see some of these women are dressing any way they please, and that Israel is indeed a free country, and not controlled by the lunatic fringe. But unfortunately the damage has already been done and the front page news in the secular international press has caused many of us to think that Israel is kinda worrisome.
Hareidim are the only group in Israel who have a long-term view for the land and for its future and theirs - not MO, not israeli arabs, not chilonim, not russians, not foreign workers, not PA citizens, not anyone else.
ReplyDeleteWhat on earth are you talking about? YOU are being divisive right here in your high-handed comment. Only the Hareidim? Thanks for dismissing all of Jewry. What's their long term plan for the land and its future that all the other Jews, especially the ones settling it, are failing at?
Who are you yelling at Anonymou? Who is being high-handed and divisive?
ReplyDeleteWhoa, where did that one come from? What is MO? Excuse my ignorance. Also, as I stated in my first comment, "This does not excuse human indecency, but it does explain it." So the teshuvah of such people will only be b'Yirah, at least for now, because that is the only tool that they have. Teshuvah b'Ahavah from people with destroyed brains stems might not be possible until there is a Divine healing. Yet, by and large we should not wait until we can do it b'Ahavah to do Teshuvah b'Yirah which can be done with damaged soul and all. But what is MO?
ReplyDeleteMO is Modern Orthodox.
ReplyDeleteAll these labels ARE the problem.
OMG: MO is Modern Orthodox. So that is a bit a causeless disgust. He is saying that National Religious Jews do not have the long view of life in Eretz Yisrael. Who in Heaven's Name does this guy think he is?
ReplyDeleteI forgot to put the quotes on the first comment I quoted from Daniela's second paragraph -- that's where it came from. You don't think that's divisive and arrogant comment? I do.
ReplyDeleteYes, labels are a problem but another problem is thinking those precious Jews who have sacrificed their lives - literally- to settle the land are somehow doing less and are myopic in their view compared to the Hareidim! National religious HAVE BEEN AND ARE, fighting and dying for Israel. They aren't spitting on anyone. They don't vote for left wing traitors. They are the tip of the spear whether you want to admit it or not.
Causing distress to Rabbi Lau, obviously.
ReplyDeleteAs for the "mob" it seems they picked the correct word. Why don't these ladies go sunbathe on tel aviv beach? With the clothing they are comfortable with, it goes without saying. But of course, their purpose is not to dress as they please, while respecting other people's right to dress as they please too; it is to harass and offend other people's sensitivities. Sorry no sympathy from here.
Really, the knot is much deeper than halachic interpretations. This is about the very nature of the Medinat. Would any hypotetical Ms Margolies and her supporters insist on her child walking to a brand new Modern Orthodox school to be set up in Umm Al Fahm? Oh, wait, that would be a provocation.... But people need to decide: is Umm Al Fahm in Eretz Israel, or not? If not, let's withdraw as Yisrael Beiteinu suggests, and let them and their Arab brothers and neighbours pay for their expenses; if so, why should provocations be directed to the haredim only? What about the IDF, why is it so important to force some soldiers to hear female singing? You explain me. And this is done by supposedly religious jews and rabbis in the IDF? Had this happened elsewhere, or with another minority, can we imagine the high screams?
There are haredim in Zurich, NYC, Antwerp, etc etc etc.... no frei jew and no modern orthodox jew harasses them outside of Israel. Is this not basic decency?
Let's face it Daniela. You aren't too fond of many Jews - at least not Jews outside your special, special group who are beyond criticism and judgement but not above doling it out to the less than holy. They deserve rebuke for their disgusting behavior. Spitting at women is not all they do. They stalk women and go to their homes and terrorize them if they aren't up to their taliban standards. They aren't being G-dly.
ReplyDeleteThe phrase to remember? Mida kneged mida...
Spitting upon a person denotes mental problems in addition to total lack of derech eretz; however, spitting upon a person is not something that can be hidden, and as I am well aware that even for supposed words, people are thrown very easily into jail, I am very wary about believing stories where no arrest was made, where the mother is not that observant even though she wants her daughter to have a religious education, and where certain media are having a field day. In any case no one, and not me, is condoning damaging everyone's dignity by spitting upon a person, be it a jewish girl or xian priests in jerusalem. Let the latter spit upon each others!
ReplyDeleteI have nothing against people who settle the land. I do think the land needs to be annexed (I refer to Yudea and Shomron, I don't know about the areas with strategic role, this is for the military to decide their status). But a decision needs to be made, there is no other country which does not have definite borders for such a significant percentage in area and in length. People built Sharm-el-Sheikh tourist infrastructure when there was plenty of rhetoric, and then Sinai was given away (and of course jewish investments went down the drain). After Sinai, time passed, people forgot, and at a time, there were significant incentives to settle, but then what will happen? What happened in Aza? There needs to be a clear policy either way, and if there is, no one will risk their lives, as Arabs will have to be compensated and sent on their way. Then we will all be able to invest in the land, whatever our observance, knowing that we will only have to deal with Eliyahu Ha Navi who comes with the land titles, and then, at that time, we will no doubt find good and mutually agreeable solutions. Be it tomorrow or in a hundred years. In the meantime, I am sure you can understand I have reservations upon a few things that are going on beyond the former "green line".
There's no way you or I can know the depth of religiosity of the mother you're referring to. That's the Truth. Please quit blaming her for the terrible behavior of the Jews who spit at her and called her daughter a whore. This is why we don't have the Temple because of this kind of thinking. Where is your love for Jews? Your compassion? She's not guilty of anything! So what if she wants her daughter to have a religious education? We should be applauding her for heavens sake.
ReplyDeleteThe land belongs to us - it was given to us by Hashem. Jews have a right to live anywhere on the land. We don't have to wait for Elijahu Ha Navi to show up with the land titles.
Anon: Agree totally. Blaming the victim is an epidemic today.
ReplyDeleteDevora, some of your comments are a bit off. Dov in no way seemed to be condoning the behaviour, so why bring up your example of paedophiles? And as for your question to Daniela, the rav in question who was upset is Rav Lau.??
ReplyDeleteAs for Israel being a free country, it is freeish, but it is controlled by a lunatic fringe, aka the ultra-left. Because they control everything, their values are presented as a given against which everything else is judged. Torah values are only acceptable when they meet their requirements, otherwise they are ridiculed. (I am not talking about Beit Shemesh, but true Torah values). And of course it is perfectly "normal" that they impose their secular coercion on the rest of us.
And as for your relief, you seem to have missed the point that the main problem is an unprecedented campaign of media incitement and official hounding of religious people in Israel (both hareidim and national religious). In some of these instances those in the spotlight did not behave in accordance with the Torah and in some they did. Either way they lose. This is what is truly worrying.
In the meantime every other week in Israel a woman is murdered by her partner, twenty per cent of women in the IDF suffer from sexual harassment, and over 80% from unwanted sexual attention, and thousands of women are trapped in forced prostitution. Methinks that these would be the issues du jour for someone who cares about women's rights.
I know Dov wasn't condoning it, but if we're going to start making excuses for peoples' behavior, then where does it end?
ReplyDeleteYes obviously it is Rabbi Lau, I thought perhaps Daniela was referring to one of the 'rabbis'hurling the abuse.
And I may well have missed the point that the Israeli media is anti-hareidi.... but I am just passing on the feeling from many Jews outside of Israel, who are often presented with this kind of news and then told to make aliyah.
Your point about the violence against women generally, in Israel and elsewhere, is excellent. So much for Jews treating their women like a queen.... I think everyone needs to go back and start from the beginning.
As I already wrote, do you seriously believe she would dare walking in Dubai or Singapore or in Puri (just to change religion for variety) with the tight top she had in a video. If so, let her go there, along with TV, Haaretz photographer, iPhone, etc. If not, why she can not have such a courtesy towards her fellow jews?
ReplyDeleteI am a woman, I have met harassers in life and have handled them. So will our children, may we all have more and more, until Moshiach. We had no problem discussing with our children that, should someone harass them, spit upon them, throw stones or garbage etc., they should talk gently to the shoteh, apologize profusely (regardless of having done anything minutely wrong, or not at all) and quickly leave, and afterwards, they should tell us immediately. You see, we had already told them so, when we have had to explain them about the TV videos showing how some nonjewish children going to their school according to the law of the land, and who have to walk close enough to certain jewish villages beyond the former green line, are seen as a provocation and regularly harassed (and accompanied to school by IDF). Your indignation about the "child" is exclusively instrumental to your agenda.
I have never spitted upon anyone, even though I have been spitted upon and hit by many people. Rabbi taught me that it is not fitting to our dignity, and that if necessary and appropriate, we should instead humiliate the antisemite rasha in public, by calmly answering "I will not spit upon you, you are not worthy of a high-speed kiss of mine. I will not slap your face, you are not worthy of a high-speed caress by me." And so on. I have never been spitted upon by a jew, and it is not a circumstance I am willing to deal with.
I don't dispute the fact you live in the land, but I do take issue with the fact that it is very hard to make a honest living in the land, especially with qualified people, due to the burden of taxes and unfortunately, also to corruption. However there are some people who live in the land who have no hesitation in badly advising others to invest or to make aliyah and bring their professionality and capitals to Israel, because it furthers their own interest and without caring if this is the right choice for others, and thus causing fellow jews to lose upon their assets (did you read, on this very blog, about the person who invested in shekalim?) or worse (did you read, again on this blog, about the person who became homeless and sick after making aliyah?) Sometimes, these people will not even hesitate in spreading lies (did you read, yet again on this blog, about the other person who asked a "rabbi" and was told disaster will strike anyone who does not make aliyah right now? And who, upon looking into this "rabbi"'s credentials, found out a thing or two?)
Hasn't this gone on long enough? Does anyone remember what happened to the spies for slandering the land? Yes, the erev rav are in control in Israel and many Jews are off the derech. But Israel is a good land and it's our land. Can't we stop tearing Israel down and stop trying to have the last word? We are not Dubai or Singapore or any other country so why compare their punishment for immodesty to Israel? Do you want a Jewish woman caned for wearing short sleeves? We should be like the rebbetzin who gently offered a sweater to the woman who wasn't properly dressed to see the rabbi. At least whe wanted to see the rabbi. Pray for Jew , all Jews instead of trashing them.
ReplyDeleteEven the Jews in Egypt who had fallen to the 49th level of tumah were connected to Hashem. Leave this Jewish woman alone..
ReplyDelete"All these labels ARE the problem. "
ReplyDeleteCouldn't agree more.
Daniela, You make a lot of assumptions about things that are written in articles as if they are completely true. There is a definite agenda by the media to push a storyline. That storyline changes according to the group doing the reporting. You don't KNOW the truth of the matters of which you write, so you are damaging those in the article and all of us reading this blog with your accusations.
ReplyDeleteBy the way, do you have anything good to say about Eretz Yisrael? Because I don't think I have read anything positive from you on it yet. You focus on a few posts that have written negative things and dismiss the many posts that have very positive things to say about EY. The mind sees what it wants to see and it disregards the rest.
Sorry Daniela but I'm going to delete your last comment, it's totally unfair to judge the mother in this way.
ReplyDeleteWhy stop at the last article? She denigrates the MO too. Do us a favor and delete them all. They're negative and ugly.
ReplyDeleteEveryone is entitled to their opinion, I just draw the line at outright lashon hora [I'm only leaving your comment here because the name Daniela is a common one, and the person concerned is not necessarily identifiable to anyone who happens to read this], but personal attacks are not acceptable either. Sigh, Daniela if you want that comment removed, please let me know.
ReplyDeleteYes, I have a habit of getting informed about facts, which actually is an obligation. I sure hope you all did the same. I am well aware articles on newspapers are not completely true, which goes both ways. I suspect most readers have not talked to anyone in Bet Shemesh. I will leave it at that, but I am going to ask a tiny little question. Does anyone remember the "taliban ladies"? How comes this case makes much more noise? Even if (a big IF) an idiot had spat upon the child, you do not think it is possible to move on? Assuming there is a problem, you do not think a solution can be arranged, be it the mother dressing differently, or be it a sidewalk reserved to women, with haredi men walking on the other side of the street? On the other hands, the "talibans" were / are a group who is potentially dangerous as these ladies and their children are not seeing doctors, their family life is a problem, the children don't go to school, and so on. Yet, the media did not bite the juicy news. There was an article or two, that's all. You don't think there is a disproportion? Oh, wait, I have good memory. I remember a few sympathetic articles about that lady and her followers (who, for any reader who does not know about Bet Shemesh and Ramat Bet Shemesh, has nothing to do with haredi: the ladies in that group are converts or recently religious from non observant families). Nobody worried about them? About their children? Everything is silent! I am curious, Devorah, you are not disturbed by that? You are not worried? You don't think there should be demonstrations all the time to protest it? Flash mobs too? You know, some of the children are still in their claws (others were removed by social services) and totally brainwashed by now. Not a problem with you?
ReplyDeleteI'm not really sure what you're talking about Daniela, but it does concern me that you keep referring to ''converts'' or recently religious as though they are aliens.
ReplyDeleteI seriously do not understand where you are coming from.
Frankly I've had it with the comments by Daniela. The Jewish burkah women have been reported to be baal tshuva -- not non religious or converts. She has a disdain for converts. She is dripping with sinat chinan.
ReplyDeleteLet me tell you something, Daniela: The TORAH states that a covert is never to be questioned or have the fact that they ARE ever brought up again. Once a Gentile emerges from the mikvah, they are a Jew!!! Not a suspect - a Jew. Do you know what the Torah says about hurting the Convert or how Hashem loves the convert because THEY CHOSE to become a Jew our of their love of Hashem. Maybe since you are so pious and holy you can take a moment from your judging other lowly Jews and take another look at what the Torah has to say about how to treat a convert.
Exactly. And sincere apologies to anyone who has been offended by any of these comments.
ReplyDelete