From Rabbi Chananya Weissman: So hundreds of terrorists were able to cross the border by surprise and capture entire communities, with little to no military response for many hours, in a country blanketed by cameras, with supposedly some of the best intelligence in the world, and we're supposed to believe this was a surprise attack. Never forget that the country is run by Erev Rav who work for Amalek. May Hashem save us from the enemies within as much as the enemies outside our land.
Michal, you said it all. Absolutely correct. Sounds like a very much preplanned event, r'l. May H' avenge the blood of the victims by these demonic creatures, yimach shmom v'zichrom.
"Never forget that the country is run by Erev Rav who work for Amalek." Wow. What exactly is it that this "Amalek government" wants to achieve by "allowing" Hamas to slaughter hundreds of its own citizens? What is the "Amaleki-Israeli" government's end game for supposedly knowing about this attack, and not doing anything about it? If you're going to peddle a conspiracy theory, then at least provide a rationale for it.
to anonymous - those people amalekim are monsters, a normal human being cannot understand their logic and motivations. Instead of closing your eyes, ears, please try to look closely at the facts on the ground and then you'll come to the same conclusion.
Anonymous at 3:58 - I don't understand your answer to me. You are calling the Israeli government Erev Rav who work for Amalek. You are calling the Israeli government monsters. You accuse the Israeli government of knowing about this attack and deliberately not acting to stop it. How else should one interpret what you wrote: "we're supposed to believe this was a surprise attack. Never forget that the country is run by Erev Rav who work for Amalek. May Hashem save us from the enemies within ..." What do you think the Israeli government wanted to accomplish by supposedly allowing Hamas to enter the country and slaughter hundreds of Israeli citizens?
I think R' Brody said something to the effect that Hashem orchestrated that Iran came up with the brilliant plan for Hamas to use drones that knocked out the border surveillance cameras, and to use other multi-pronged tactics such as the rockets and gliders. M.M.
When someone without military experience says that this was a conspiracy, they can make a strong case.
But that can only be considered by listening to people with military experience.
There are a number of reasons how this could have happened with no conspiracy at all.
1.) The border was not staffed to full levels because troops had been stationed in the Shomron because of the recent terrorist upsurge there.
2.) Troops had gone home for Shabbat and the Chagim.
3.) Hamas had been relatively quiet the last few months, not joining in when the IDF launched Operation Shield and Arrow against Palestinian Islamic Jihad. This lulled the government into a false sense of security regarding Hamas.
4.) As Rav Brody said, drones knocked out the cameras near the fence.
5.) A military base of the Southern Command was captured, and communications from there to other units were jammed.
6.) The fence was breached in multiple places, and also Hamas flew over it. The people monitoring the fence did see it get cut, even with some cameras knocked out, and reported it, but with so many breaches, reports would have been confusing.
7.) Special Forces units got told around 7AM. But first they had to make a list of priorities to respond to and plan the counter attack.
8.) With 22 villages/kibbutzim under simultaneous attack, how do you prioritise?
9.) Even with a large fleet of drones, how do these help when trying to see where terrorists are inside peoples homes?
10.) Individual troops did respond, driving their own cars to get to the trouble. But with 1500 Hamas terrorists on the ground, the roads were not safe and some got murdered whilst driving to help.
11.) The fence was not secure, so Hamas continued to send in terrorists.
12.) Huge rocket bombardments from Gaza hindered the mustering of troops. People had to take to shelter instead of heading directly to bases.
Obviously everything is from Hashem. How it actually happened in our terms is open to debate. The feeling in Israel is one of shock and literal disbelief. We are constantly being told we are the start-up nation and the hi-tech army. A lot of be'kochi uve'otsem yadi. This wasn't an infiltration by one or two terrorists, but a total invasion of at least 1500 terrorists including in vehicles, despite our state of the art technology border fence and whole units whose only job is to surveille the border. The next unbelievable aspect is that these terrorists went on the rampage for hours on end without a military response (local security people, the police and ravshatzim did their best, some of them saved their kibbutz or yishuv, but it required the military). One of the captured terrorists said in his innterrogation that they themselves couldn't believe it.
My personal feeling is that this was an inside job from a highup in the army. The ultra Left tried everything to bring down this government. After the Yom Kippur TA tefilla attacks, which massively backfired against them, even leading many so-called chilonim to embrace their Yahadut, the ultra Left wrote about their disappointment and frustration. They had lost any residual backing, even from their silent base. It's my feeling and I think the most logical explanation. Even if the the infiltration itself could be explained away, the delay in responding cannot. It's both to punish the nation for not supporting the Left and to get them back into the government (a disunity government being set up as I write, it won't be true unity, as the Leftist goal is not the good of the nation, but to undermine it).
Regarding international support, I am cynical about that too. This is what it takes to get people on board. A mini Shoah, mini only in the number of people, but no difference in the cruelty and obsession to murder Jews. After the Shoah we had some sympathy but it didn't take too long to dissipate. The world loves humiliated and cowering or dead Jews, not Jews who fight back. Thousands of people are going to be killed in Gaza, and then we will be criticised and called on to show restraint. Even now I'm seeing, 'but the occupation'. Jews trust only in Hashem, not in basar vedam.
I hope Moshiach comes very very soon. If we end up having more elections, the right wing is going to be huge. In the last election, many young people just under the voting age were strident supporters of Ben Gvir. I'm a meek little dove compared to them. And they live in bourgeois style yishuvim, not hilltop youth. Now it's going to explode.
Unless Moshiach comes very soon, or Hashem makes us an open miracle, the Three and a Half Day War, this war is not expected to be resolved in a matter of days.
Definitely an inside job.....ein od milvado. It's all so confusing, horrifying, all we can do is pray and trust that even this is all for good. How can this be good?? How is it possible to do that??? Hashem help us. Pray, Tehillim and asking Him constantly to lead us and hear His voice, give us discernment and personal direction. Cling to Him and don't let go.
I first heard about the attacks during shabbat, and my comment above was my gut reaction. Since then I have seen and heard many expressing similar sentiments, including in a question put to Professor Kedar in a serious setting. Specifically it was asked if there are collaborators in the army.
In other, more positive news, 100,000 Israelis have returned to Israel on account of the situation, many to join their units, and at the same time 50,000 tourists have left. Hopefully, that would include many missionaries. Let's not forget that in these terrible times, missionaries are circling like vultures. Rav Kahana, at nachmankahana.com, wrote a while ago that something would happen to cause all the non-Jews leave Israel, and only the Jews who love EY would remain.
Same thing here Malky, a group of xtian tourists stranded, blaming the Australian government for not rescuing them.
Can't remember where I read it, maybe Tomer Devorah blog somewhere, that non-Jews will flee Israel and Jews will return [the soldiers etc]. Yes sure some Jews left to go back home, they were just visiting for the chag, but Israeli males returned home to fight.
In Numbers chapter 25, when Balaam could not curse Israel, he advised Balak to join and mix with them, and then Hashem would punish them. This Abraham accord between Israel and the Muslim nations is supposed to do the same to Israel, seeing they can not be defeated militarily. This approach lately to join Saudi Arabia seemed just going too far, it seems to have cause the "fierce anger" of Hashem as explained in Numbers 25:4 to bring this most terrible judgment upon Israel. After all, if it was wrong for Israel to join Moab at that time, then to join the Moslems today is just as wrong as it was then. May Hashem heal and bless Israel!
Rav Meir's shiur is really good, but long. I hope someone can summarise it. In short, ashemim anachnu, achim shel yosef. We are guilty. We shouldn't be looking to blame anyone, and most importantly all the victims are our brothers and sisters. He prays all the hostages return home alive.
And don't think America sending its battleship off the coast is for our benefit.
If there was a lack of modesty, how is my modesty lacking? For men and women. If there was chilul shabat and chag, how am I causing chilul shabat and chag? If there was tuma, where is the tuma in my life?
We have to be melitz yosher for all of am yisrael. Am Yisrael has an unbreakable bond with the Kadosh Baruch Hu, even regardless of our actions. Those of us with a Torah consciousness, even if we are not perfect, bear the responsibility for those who don't. We want Hashem to judge us favorably and overlook our failings, so we should do the same for each other.
Listening to a shiur, of what the next step is, chalila a million times, when Edom and Yishmael join, chalila. Every Jew every where in the world needs to know that our only true safe space is with Hashem. All the things we thought we could rely on, the government, the army, the safe room, whatever it is we are relying on, it's all an illusion.
Michal: I had to think about this before I published your comment, but in the interests of everyone being allowed to express their opinion, I decided to publish it. However, I'm not entirely sure about it, because I don't think we should be hurling accusations which may or may not be true. Whatever the case, people can make up their own minds, and ultimately the truth will out, although at this stage we don't really know what is true and what is pure propaganda.
But the more I think about it, the more I feel that link should not be there at this time. So I removed your comment, and I'm sorry but right now Israel needs support. Truth will out in the end, leave it in the Hands of G-d. I just don't want my blog linking to that story, many anti-semitic people are reading this blog now, we don't need to give them any more ammunition and the video may or may NOT be true. I'm sorry but that's my decision.... if in doubt, leave it out... good advice I follow on a daily basis.
Thank you Michal, unpublished as you predicted, but I appreciate your thoughts. I am aware, I am trying to avoid getting political, I will leave that to the Israelis who know far more than I do.
Thanks to the commenters here about the "inside job" - that caused me to dig a bit, and find the recent vid's of autistic-Daniel (and another/verbal autistic) which indeed confirmed the above. I also came across some very enlightening (if time-consuming) vid's featuring Jonathan Pollard on Rumble.
So, LondonMale, my 1st comment above which quoted R'Brody naively assumed that the Rav might not be withholding the entire reality, for cautionary reasons. But by now I assume he surely knows the reality behind the facade. Granted, there's no absolute proof, but I suggest you listen to your gut even if that's not your preference. Your gut should scream "too many intelligent people have been screaming foul, so try giving the benefit of the doubt to those perpetually labelled as conspiratists". Instead call them "conspiracy Realists" as Dr.Zelenko called himself. Or "conspiracy Analysts" as Foster Gamble called himself.
As for the EvaVlaar twitter video, I'd go with what she says, although I must frankly point out that she threw in "judicial reform" along with Covid & Climate by labelling ALL of them money-wasting schemes. Yet whereas the C&C schemes were indeed fund-wasters, judicial reform absolutely was not. Hey, if there's one factor that might lessen G-d's wrath at the current government (whom I don't envy) it would be the judicial-reform efforts. M.M.
Regarding apportioning blame, let's be clear, it was Arabs who perpetrated the massacres that they had been planning for a year. They are absolutely and completely responsible for their actions. At the same time in Israel there has very much been a feeling that something is seriously wrong. This was a military invasion that went undetected and then unanswered for many hours. Whether it was incompetence or something worse we don't know for sure at the moment. I'm not saying the truth doesn't matter, it does, and those responsible for the military failure should be held accountable. At the same time, it was from Hashem. All the things that we rely on were simply illusionary. If Hashem doesn't guard a city, the guards guard in vain. We all have things that we think are protecting us and it is all illusionary. Hashem is removing everything that separates us from Him directly.
I regret writing some of the things I wrote above as they can be used against us. Please let's not add to it. Now that Am Yisrael is united, it's the best time for Moshiach to come. Please let's try to stay united.
I know that this is also a very challenging time for Jews in the diaspora, but please understand that in Israel in addition to the terrible pain we all feel, it has been and still is completely nerve-wracking. I have lived through many, many security situations in Israel, but this is completely different.
Thank you for that LL. I have never felt comfortable blaming anyone for this, because as you say if Hashem doesn't guard a city, the guards guard in vain. I also don't feel it is helpful at all to Israel to apportion blame in the middle of a war. That is tantamount to treason.
From Rabbi Chananya Weissman: So hundreds of terrorists were able to cross the border by surprise and capture entire communities, with little to no military response for many hours, in a country blanketed by cameras, with supposedly some of the best intelligence in the world, and we're supposed to believe this was a surprise attack. Never forget that the country is run by Erev Rav who work for Amalek. May Hashem save us from the enemies within as much as the enemies outside our land.
ReplyDeleteMichal, you said it all. Absolutely correct.
ReplyDeleteSounds like a very much preplanned event, r'l.
May H' avenge the blood of the victims by these demonic creatures, yimach shmom v'zichrom.
"Never forget that the country is run by Erev Rav who work for Amalek."
ReplyDeleteWow. What exactly is it that this "Amalek government" wants to achieve by "allowing" Hamas to slaughter hundreds of its own citizens? What is the "Amaleki-Israeli" government's end game for supposedly knowing about this attack, and not doing anything about it?
If you're going to peddle a conspiracy theory, then at least provide a rationale for it.
to anonymous - those people amalekim are monsters, a normal human being cannot understand their logic and motivations.
ReplyDeleteInstead of closing your eyes, ears, please try to look closely at the facts on the ground and then you'll come to the same conclusion.
Anonymous at 3:58 - I don't understand your answer to me. You are calling the Israeli government Erev Rav who work for Amalek. You are calling the Israeli government monsters. You accuse the Israeli government of knowing about this attack and deliberately not acting to stop it. How else should one interpret what you wrote: "we're supposed to believe this was a surprise attack. Never forget that the country is run by Erev Rav who work for Amalek. May Hashem save us from the enemies within ..."
ReplyDeleteWhat do you think the Israeli government wanted to accomplish by supposedly allowing Hamas to enter the country and slaughter hundreds of Israeli citizens?
I think R' Brody said something to the effect that Hashem orchestrated that Iran came up with the brilliant plan for Hamas to use drones that knocked out the border surveillance cameras, and to use other multi-pronged tactics such as the rockets and gliders.
ReplyDeleteM.M.
https://twitter.com/EvaVlaar/status/1711091575567081911
ReplyDeleteWhen someone without military experience says that this was a conspiracy, they can make a strong case.
ReplyDeleteBut that can only be considered by listening to people with military experience.
There are a number of reasons how this could have happened with no conspiracy at all.
1.) The border was not staffed to full levels because troops had been stationed in the Shomron because of the recent terrorist upsurge there.
2.) Troops had gone home for Shabbat and the Chagim.
3.) Hamas had been relatively quiet the last few months, not joining in when the IDF launched Operation Shield and Arrow against Palestinian Islamic Jihad.
This lulled the government into a false sense of security regarding Hamas.
4.) As Rav Brody said, drones knocked out the cameras near the fence.
5.) A military base of the Southern Command was captured, and communications from there to other units were jammed.
6.) The fence was breached in multiple places, and also Hamas flew over it.
The people monitoring the fence did see it get cut, even with some cameras knocked out, and reported it, but with so many breaches, reports would have been confusing.
7.) Special Forces units got told around 7AM. But first they had to make a list of priorities to respond to and plan the counter attack.
8.) With 22 villages/kibbutzim under simultaneous attack, how do you prioritise?
9.) Even with a large fleet of drones, how do these help when trying to see where terrorists are inside peoples homes?
10.) Individual troops did respond, driving their own cars to get to the trouble. But with 1500 Hamas terrorists on the ground, the roads were not safe and some got murdered whilst driving to help.
11.) The fence was not secure, so Hamas continued to send in terrorists.
12.) Huge rocket bombardments from Gaza hindered the mustering of troops. People had to take to shelter instead of heading directly to bases.
Obviously everything is from Hashem. How it actually happened in our terms is open to debate. The feeling in Israel is one of shock and literal disbelief. We are constantly being told we are the start-up nation and the hi-tech army. A lot of be'kochi uve'otsem yadi. This wasn't an infiltration by one or two terrorists, but a total invasion of at least 1500 terrorists including in vehicles, despite our state of the art technology border fence and whole units whose only job is to surveille the border. The next unbelievable aspect is that these terrorists went on the rampage for hours on end without a military response (local security people, the police and ravshatzim did their best, some of them saved their kibbutz or yishuv, but it required the military). One of the captured terrorists said in his innterrogation that they themselves couldn't believe it.
ReplyDeleteMy personal feeling is that this was an inside job from a highup in the army. The ultra Left tried everything to bring down this government. After the Yom Kippur TA tefilla attacks, which massively backfired against them, even leading many so-called chilonim to embrace their Yahadut, the ultra Left wrote about their disappointment and frustration. They had lost any residual backing, even from their silent base. It's my feeling and I think the most logical explanation. Even if the the infiltration itself could be explained away, the delay in responding cannot. It's both to punish the nation for not supporting the Left and to get them back into the government (a disunity government being set up as I write, it won't be true unity, as the Leftist goal is not the good of the nation, but to undermine it).
Regarding international support, I am cynical about that too. This is what it takes to get people on board. A mini Shoah, mini only in the number of people, but no difference in the cruelty and obsession to murder Jews. After the Shoah we had some sympathy but it didn't take too long to dissipate. The world loves humiliated and cowering or dead Jews, not Jews who fight back. Thousands of people are going to be killed in Gaza, and then we will be criticised and called on to show restraint. Even now I'm seeing, 'but the occupation'. Jews trust only in Hashem, not in basar vedam.
I hope Moshiach comes very very soon. If we end up having more elections, the right wing is going to be huge. In the last election, many young people just under the voting age were strident supporters of Ben Gvir. I'm a meek little dove compared to them. And they live in
bourgeois style yishuvim, not hilltop youth. Now it's going to explode.
Unless Moshiach comes very soon, or Hashem makes us an open miracle, the Three and a Half Day War, this war is not expected to be resolved in a matter of days.
L.L.
I always say I learn more from the comments on my blog than I do from anywhere else. Thank you everyone for your informative words.
ReplyDeleteDefinitely an inside job.....ein od milvado. It's all so confusing, horrifying, all we can do is pray and trust that even this is all for good. How can this be good?? How is it possible to do that??? Hashem help us. Pray, Tehillim and asking Him constantly to lead us and hear His voice, give us discernment and personal direction. Cling to Him and don't let go.
ReplyDeleteI first heard about the attacks during shabbat, and my comment above was my gut reaction. Since then I have seen and heard many expressing similar sentiments, including in a question put to Professor Kedar in a serious setting. Specifically it was asked if there are collaborators in the army.
ReplyDeleteIn other, more positive news, 100,000 Israelis have returned to Israel on account of the situation, many to join their units, and at the same time 50,000 tourists have left. Hopefully, that would include many missionaries. Let's not forget that in these terrible times, missionaries are circling like vultures. Rav Kahana, at nachmankahana.com, wrote a while ago that something would happen to cause all the non-Jews leave Israel, and only the Jews who love EY would remain.
L.L.
46 members of a church group is begging biden for a way home to California from Isreal where they are now. Malky
DeleteSame thing here Malky, a group of xtian tourists stranded, blaming the Australian government for not rescuing them.
ReplyDeleteCan't remember where I read it, maybe Tomer Devorah blog somewhere, that non-Jews will flee Israel and Jews will return [the soldiers etc]. Yes sure some Jews left to go back home, they were just visiting for the chag, but Israeli males returned home to fight.
I heard tonight the terrorist were speaking Fausi? There’s only one country that speaks that language. Iran!
ReplyDeletehttps://lazerbeams.com/operation-iron-swords-the-massacre-that-triggered-the-war/
ReplyDeleteL.L.
In Numbers chapter 25, when Balaam could not curse Israel, he advised Balak to join and mix with them, and then Hashem would punish them. This Abraham accord between Israel and the Muslim nations is supposed to do the same to Israel, seeing they can not be defeated militarily. This approach lately to join Saudi Arabia seemed just going too far, it seems to have cause the "fierce anger" of Hashem as explained in Numbers 25:4 to bring this most terrible judgment upon Israel. After all, if it was wrong for Israel to join Moab at that time, then to join the Moslems today is just as wrong as it was then. May Hashem heal and bless Israel!
ReplyDeleteRav Meir's shiur is really good, but long. I hope someone can summarise it.
ReplyDeleteIn short, ashemim anachnu, achim shel yosef. We are guilty. We shouldn't be looking to blame anyone, and most importantly all the victims are our brothers and sisters. He prays all the hostages return home alive.
And don't think America sending its battleship off the coast is for our benefit.
L.L.
If there was a lack of modesty, how is my modesty lacking? For men and women.
ReplyDeleteIf there was chilul shabat and chag, how am I causing chilul shabat and chag?
If there was tuma, where is the tuma in my life?
We have to be melitz yosher for all of am yisrael. Am Yisrael has an unbreakable bond with the Kadosh Baruch Hu, even regardless of our actions. Those of us with a Torah consciousness, even if we are not perfect, bear the responsibility for those who don't. We want Hashem to judge us favorably and overlook our failings, so we should do the same for each other.
Listening to a shiur, of what the next step is, chalila a million times, when Edom and Yishmael join, chalila. Every Jew every where in the world needs to know that our only true safe space is with Hashem. All the things we thought we could rely on, the government, the army, the safe room, whatever it is we are relying on, it's all an illusion.
L.L.
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ReplyDeleteMichal: I had to think about this before I published your comment, but in the interests of everyone being allowed to express their opinion, I decided to publish it. However, I'm not entirely sure about it, because I don't think we should be hurling accusations which may or may not be true. Whatever the case, people can make up their own minds, and ultimately the truth will out, although at this stage we don't really know what is true and what is pure propaganda.
ReplyDeleteBut the more I think about it, the more I feel that link should not be there at this time. So I removed your comment, and I'm sorry but right now Israel needs support. Truth will out in the end, leave it in the Hands of G-d. I just don't want my blog linking to that story, many anti-semitic people are reading this blog now, we don't need to give them any more ammunition and the video may or may NOT be true. I'm sorry but that's my decision.... if in doubt, leave it out... good advice I follow on a daily basis.
ReplyDeleteThank you Michal, unpublished as you predicted, but I appreciate your thoughts. I am aware, I am trying to avoid getting political, I will leave that to the Israelis who know far more than I do.
ReplyDeleteThanks to the commenters here about the "inside job" - that caused me to dig a bit, and find the recent vid's of autistic-Daniel (and another/verbal autistic) which indeed confirmed the above. I also came across some very enlightening (if time-consuming) vid's featuring Jonathan Pollard on Rumble.
ReplyDeleteSo, LondonMale, my 1st comment above which quoted R'Brody naively assumed that the Rav might not be withholding the entire reality, for cautionary reasons. But by now I assume he surely knows the reality behind the facade. Granted, there's no absolute proof, but I suggest you listen to your gut even if that's not your preference. Your gut should scream "too many intelligent people have been screaming foul, so try giving the benefit of the doubt to those perpetually labelled as conspiratists". Instead call them "conspiracy Realists" as Dr.Zelenko called himself. Or "conspiracy Analysts" as Foster Gamble called himself.
As for the EvaVlaar twitter video, I'd go with what she says, although I must frankly point out that she threw in "judicial reform" along with Covid & Climate by labelling ALL of them money-wasting schemes. Yet whereas the C&C schemes were indeed fund-wasters, judicial reform absolutely was not. Hey, if there's one factor that might lessen G-d's wrath at the current government (whom I don't envy) it would be the judicial-reform efforts.
M.M.
Regarding apportioning blame, let's be clear, it was Arabs who perpetrated the massacres that they had been planning for a year. They are absolutely and completely responsible for their actions. At the same time in Israel there has very much been a feeling that something is seriously wrong. This was a military invasion that went undetected and then unanswered for many hours. Whether it was incompetence or something worse we don't know for sure at the moment. I'm not saying the truth doesn't matter, it does, and those responsible for the military failure should be held accountable. At the same time, it was from Hashem. All the things that we rely on were simply illusionary. If Hashem doesn't guard a city, the guards guard in vain.
ReplyDeleteWe all have things that we think are protecting us and it is all illusionary. Hashem is removing everything that separates us from Him directly.
I regret writing some of the things I wrote above as they can be used against us. Please let's not add to it. Now that Am Yisrael is united, it's the best time for Moshiach to come. Please let's try to stay united.
I know that this is also a very challenging time for Jews in the diaspora, but please understand that in Israel in addition to the terrible pain we all feel, it has been and still is completely nerve-wracking. I have lived through many, many security situations in Israel, but this is completely different.
We have no-one to rely on but Avinu bashamayim.
L.L.
Thank you for that LL. I have never felt comfortable blaming anyone for this, because as you say if Hashem doesn't guard a city, the guards guard in vain.
ReplyDeleteI also don't feel it is helpful at all to Israel to apportion blame in the middle of a war. That is tantamount to treason.