He may have just laughed because the others started to laugh, and laughing is contagious. Also whilst he may have said it as a joke or a bracha perhaps, the words that came out of his mouth proved to be prophetic.
Allevei if only you knew ! Rebbe did not make mistakes my friend. the Rebbe did not make mistakes. He knew what he was telling to Netanyahu. If only you knew the Rebbe !! you would understand this. we miss him so much. there has been nobody like him and nobody who comes even close to what he was.
No one is doubting the Rebbe was making a mistake. People here just aren’t sure what the rebbe meant when he said to Netanyahu “you can stay here”. Maybe he meant to stay in the US.
I think he did mean for him to stay in the US, for how long I do not know. But as none of us were there, we can't really know, we only have Netanyahu's memoir to go on, and the fact that the Rebbe said those words about Moshiach and Bibi remembered all this time, is a sign for me. I understand why you think it's confusing, but I know when the Rebbe said something it could come true way into the future.
I haven't seen such a video. I have read in many places that the Rebbe said something about the keys, but I have never read it on any Chabad site. Now I see that it was another mekubal who said the line about the keys. If you know where to find the video you are speaking of, please send a link through.
Was Netanyahu living in America at the time? Why would you think that the Rebbe was telling Netanyahu to stay in America until Moshiach comes, Devorah?
It was 1984, he was obviously in America because the Rebbe did not leave New York. Bibi went to 770 for Simchat Torah.
If you watch the link to Bibi at the UN you can see he was saying some good things at the UN and the Rebbe wanted him to continue doing that for a while. That's my summation of what was going on back then. I can't say I remember any of it, but I did blog the post below in 2011.
I was asking if Netanyahu was living in America at the time, not if he was meeting the Rebbe in America. I’m almost certain he was living in Israel. The rebbe wouldn’t tell him to stay in America and not got back to Israel.
The main thing is that the Rebbe and this Rav also said the same words. The time table, as we can all see, is very relevant and I do believe that it will be the PM Bibi who will hand over the 'keys' as the two Rabbanim said, over to Moshiach. We are now truly in awesome times. HaShanah b'Yerushalayim Habenuyah!
Bibi was living in Eretz Yisroel at the time of this video with the Rebbe. The Rebbe clearly was not telling Bibi to stay in the states. He was telling Bibi that he will stay PM until Moshiach.
Ron: the video from R Chaya is very good, he's speaking French and he's speaking exactly as I feel.... you can get the English subtitles. Yes he says "in a few days". If anyone wants the exact date they can write to him, not sure if the email address is there or not.
CS I saw what you are talking about and I wouldn't worry too much about anything right now, everything will be ok in the end and if it's not ok, then it's not the end.
Is Rabbi Ron Chaya’s quote from a code in the Zohar reliable? Not asking if the Zohar is reliable.. of course it is. Asking if his interpretation of the Zohar into a code is reliable to predict Moshiach is about to arrive now?
If anyone is having trouble getting the English subtitles, follow these steps
click on settings cog, bottom right of video click on subtitles click on French auto generated then again click on French auto generated and you will get auto translate where you can choose your language
One thing he did for sure say in the video is that Moshiach will be here in a few days. That’s beyond incredible and of course he doesn’t mean a few months if he said a few days. We will see this week if he is right.
Rav Ron Chaya is not a mekubal. He is a big talmid chaham with his own yeshiva in Jerusalem and his french speaking kiruv organisation that you can also find at https://myleava.fr/
In reply to my question to him about when is the date of the geulah the Zohar talks about he cited (also in his lecture) tikunei Zohar page 55a but he asked me not to reveal the date as he is not sure that it will be this year. Also, there may be other options for geulah to arrive either this year or another year. If you'll look by yourself in that Zohar page you will find what it's talking about, the festival of weeks, ie. Shavuot but again, there is no guarantee, this is just one option. We will have to wait and see what happens.
Ron, you're forgetting the option for the geula to come today. Rav David Toldedano is organising a big tefilla today/tomorrow, last day of nisan, for the geula. The latter explained at length about Rafah and the ntsostot a little while ago. All the while, saying he hopes the geula would be now.
The geula comes in response to tefilla (Rav Meir Eliyahu gives a whole shiur with sources about this), to zaaka (Rav Zamir, and many other rabbonim), and that even if everything is ready, without tefilla/zaaka there is no geula. In black and white in one of Rav Zamir's books, in the name of Rabeinu Bachya. Pondering future dates is actually counter-productive, as you can't do that and be in a place of zaaka.
I have been following Rav Shaya for quite a while, from well before the war. He has always said he doesn't know for sure, but felt that it is very close. He has never spoken in terms of years. Rav Zis'holtz said that it is this year, and that it was decreed on asara betevet. Last tisha be'av Rav Zis'holtz said that it was the last one. Well before the war.
It is highly problematic, to be constantly thinking about future dates, and not thinking about the geula today. Also as a general comment not about anyone in particular: one can be bekochi uveotzem yadi regarding geula watching, coming up with cleverness in predictions etc, when what Hashem wants from us is to give up any pretensions of control over our lives, and to turn to Him alone.
Ron is not forgetting that option,he's just posting interesting videos and I like hearing what other Rabbonim are saying.
Yes we know Moshiach can come today or any day, but you also know that some dates are more auspicious than others, and some things have to be accomplished in order that Moshiach is here.
Rafach seems to be a turning point, how long we don't know but we are making progress.
Only Hashem knows if we accomplished everything for Moshiach to come in 10 minutes from now. We have no Navi to tell us that Moshiach can not come until Rafch is over.
I’m sorry but anyone who believes that Moshiach can not come “until such and such happens” is going against a foundation of Judaism. There’s a reason all the gedolim of “yesteryear” when we didn’t even have all the signs that Moshiach was arriving b’itoh were as prepared as they can be for Moshiach. The Chofetz Chaim even had a suitcase special to take with him to get to Eretz Yisrael quickly when Moshiach comes.
Eliezer, it's like Devorah Chayah mentioned here a couple of days ago.... the Chafetz Chaim etc were in the time when Moshiach could come achisheina [it is hastened], and we are probably in the time where it's b'ito [in it's time]. So maybe we do need dates, I don't know.
It also says somewhere that when Moshiach is coming everyone will know, so I assume that means we know the date in advance, even if it's just the day before. Or maybe it just means everyone will know it's Moshiach.
I think by now everyone realizes that any date that has been given so far has not materialized, and even when we get dates we don't really believe in those dates anymore, maybe it will, or maybe it won't.
But as Gedolim are the ones giving out these dates, then surely it can't be forbidden to do that ??? We're allowed to speculate when we're nearly there.
Those dates are auspicious times for Moshiach. These tzaddikim never said Moshiach can’t come today. Everyone will know before Moshiach because all the signs are here now. And by the way, it’s not even a question if we’re b’itoh or not. Of course, we’re b’itoh. We are overdue for Moshiach with so many proofs.
According to Netanyahu's book, this particular meeting with the Rebbe that everyone is asking about took place while he was in NY and working at the UN. The Rebbe said he had important things to do there and that he should stay (yes, in America). But Bibi replied that he was returning to Israel.
1.13.05 Quote: When all the ntsotsot are recovered, Moshiach will be revealed.
That can happen at any moment
Better than that, even if we haven't finished the work, Hashem can finish it, as it happened in Egypt. During the plague of the firstborn, Hashem Himself descended and recovered all the ntsotsot that were missing, and Bnei Yisrael left Egypt at midnight.
The geula can happen at any moment.
It's a process and we are in the thick of it, but at any moment Hashem can decide to interrupt the process, and it depends on our actions. End quote
All of the above are the precise words of Rav David Toledano from a live class on May 6.
As Rav Toledano says, Hashem can shorten the be'ita process, achisheina betoch be'ita (depending on our actions). Also, it's not just a question of when the geula comes, but how it comes. The problem with the constant future dating is it takes the mind and the heart off of the geula today. For years we've been told that it was going to happen at some future point. That is not zaaka, and it's been done to death. We need to get out of our heads and into our hearts and focus on wanting the geula this very minute.
You have to be careful about taking something from a clip of a rav. When you've been following a rav for a while, you see his style, and what he means when something could be open to interpretation. And how much more so with subtitles, they aren't always accurate.
We don’t even know if Moshiach coming today would be shortening the b’itoh process. Today can be the final end of the b’itoh process. Only Hashem knows. May we welcome Moshiach today!
It’s 100% certain that Moshiach is imminent. I can prove it without even mentioning all the signs. This is something most of us know about but forget easily. The Zohar clearly writes that Techiyas Hameisim will start no later than 5790. That means that Moshiach has to come well before then. Also, the Leshem (came after the Zohar) wrote that Techiyas Hameisim will be no later than 5786. And if you put together everything going on in the world now, all the signs of Moshiach fulfilled, and everything Klal Yisrael is going through now, it’s more than obvious Moshiach will be here any moment.
The point is what should our individual reaction be to the situation. Someone writes about be'ita, as if that's all there is too it, try to figure out a date, more or less, and hold tight. But that is very clearly not what our sources teach us. If bediavad Moshiach's arrival today is the end of be'itah, so be it. At that point we won't care, yet it doesn't help us before the fact. Nor does Yechiel's assertion regarding until 5786.
The question we should all be asking ourselves is what can I do today to help bring Moshiach now. Which includes talking to Hashem, telling Him why He has to bring the geula now. Nitzchuni banai. Hashem wants us to 'beat' Him, so to speak, with arguments. There is an inyan of being lehitakesh to Hashem, being stubborn before Hashem. Someone said you can't speak to Hashem like that. But that is what Hashem wants from us, especially when we do it on account of the pain in Am Yisrael, and tsar haShechina , so much sheker in the world. Our very name, Yisrael, means to struggle with Gd. We are also, yehudi, to thank Hashem, but the struggle came first.
@anonymnous, I never made an assertion saying that we have to wait until 5786. Please re-read what I wrote! I wrote that’s the deadline for techiyas hameisim (according to the Leshem). Moshiach has to come well before. Any moment now.
Since the Mekubal is laughing, it’s hard to tell if he was just making a joke or not.
ReplyDelete-Ron
He may have just laughed because the others started to laugh, and laughing is contagious. Also whilst he may have said it as a joke or a bracha perhaps, the words that came out of his mouth proved to be prophetic.
ReplyDeleteThey didn’t prove to be Moshiach until we see Moshiach came at the same time that Netanyahu is Prime Minister.
Delete-Ron
Hopefully they were prophetic, and as they align with what the Rebbe said to Bibi, I have no reason to believe otherwise.
ReplyDeleteI thought you said you weren’t sure if the Rebbe meant that Netanyahu should stay in the US?
Delete-Shai
Allevei if only you knew ! Rebbe did not make mistakes my friend.
ReplyDeletethe Rebbe did not make mistakes.
He knew what he was telling to Netanyahu.
If only you knew the Rebbe !! you would understand this.
we miss him so much.
there has been nobody like him and nobody who comes even close to what he was.
No one is doubting the Rebbe was making a mistake. People here just aren’t sure what the rebbe meant when he said to Netanyahu “you can stay here”. Maybe he meant to stay in the US.
Delete-Elisheva
I think he did mean for him to stay in the US, for how long I do not know.
ReplyDeleteBut as none of us were there, we can't really know, we only have Netanyahu's memoir to go on, and the fact that the Rebbe said those words about Moshiach and Bibi remembered all this time, is a sign for me.
I understand why you think it's confusing, but I know when the Rebbe said something it could come true way into the future.
The Lubavitcher Rebbe said the.same thing to Netanyahu. it is available on video
ReplyDeleteI haven't seen such a video. I have read in many places that the Rebbe said something about the keys, but I have never read it on any Chabad site. Now I see that it was another mekubal who said the line about the keys.
ReplyDeleteIf you know where to find the video you are speaking of, please send a link through.
'Get ready for moshiach's light. At the end of the summer the 9 months end. '
ReplyDeletehttps://youtu.be/f9FfqoX90PM?feature=shared
Ron
When does the 9 months end (the exact date), Ron, according to this another “prediction”?
Delete-Elisheva
Was Netanyahu living in America at the time? Why would you think that the Rebbe was telling Netanyahu to stay in America until Moshiach comes, Devorah?
ReplyDelete-Barry
It was 1984, he was obviously in America because the Rebbe did not leave New York. Bibi went to 770 for Simchat Torah.
ReplyDeleteIf you watch the link to Bibi at the UN you can see he was saying some good things at the UN and the Rebbe wanted him to continue doing that for a while. That's my summation of what was going on back then. I can't say I remember any of it, but I did blog the post below in 2011.
https://shiratdevorah.blogspot.com/2011/09/netanyahu-at-un-quoting-lubavitcher.html
I was asking if Netanyahu was living in America at the time, not if he was meeting the Rebbe in America. I’m almost certain he was living in Israel. The rebbe wouldn’t tell him to stay in America and not got back to Israel.
Delete-Barry
Ron, did he say three months? I think he did.
ReplyDeleteIt's all speculation though, or is he actually quoting something?
Yes Devorah at min 0:32 he says 3 more months. I don't know if he's quoting something
ReplyDeleteRon
More videos about the Zohar and Rafah:
ReplyDeleteIn FR and HEB,
https://www.youtube.com/live/vVbUA7lf-lk?feature=shared
https://youtu.be/rrxerw34lVA?feature=shared
R Ron Chaya in this last video above says that the Zohar contains the date of the geulah and that it's in a couple of days!!
Ron (not Chaya)
Which Mekubal is this?
ReplyDeleteSGK
The main thing is that the Rebbe and this Rav also said the same words.
ReplyDeleteThe time table, as we can all see, is very relevant and I do believe that
it will be the PM Bibi who will hand over the 'keys' as the two Rabbanim
said, over to Moshiach. We are now truly in awesome times.
HaShanah b'Yerushalayim Habenuyah!
Bibi was living in Eretz Yisroel at the time of this video with the Rebbe. The Rebbe clearly was not telling Bibi to stay in the states. He was telling Bibi that he will stay PM until Moshiach.
ReplyDelete-Chaim
i don't know the name of the Mekubal.
ReplyDeleteRon: the video from R Chaya is very good, he's speaking French and he's speaking exactly as I feel.... you can get the English subtitles. Yes he says "in a few days". If anyone wants the exact date they can write to him, not sure if the email address is there or not.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rrxerw34lVA
Who is Rav Ron Chaya? Is he a big Mekubal? How could he claim that Moshiach will be here so soon?
Delete-Sharon
Thank you Chaim for clarifying that.
ReplyDeleteCS I saw what you are talking about and I wouldn't worry too much about anything right now, everything will be ok in the end and if it's not ok, then it's not the end.
ReplyDeleteHe's quoting from a code in the Zohar.
ReplyDeleteIs Rabbi Ron Chaya’s quote from
Deletea code in the Zohar reliable? Not asking if the Zohar is reliable.. of course it is. Asking if his interpretation of the Zohar into a code is reliable to predict Moshiach is about to arrive now?
-Sharon
I have no idea Sharon.
ReplyDeleteIf anyone is having trouble getting the English subtitles, follow these steps
click on settings cog, bottom right of video
click on subtitles
click on French auto generated
then again click on French auto generated
and you will get auto translate where you can choose your language
One thing he did for sure say in the video is that Moshiach will be here in a few days. That’s beyond incredible and of course he doesn’t mean a few months if he said a few days. We will see this week if he is right.
ReplyDelete-Boruch
Rav Ron Chaya is not a mekubal. He is a big talmid chaham with his own yeshiva in Jerusalem and his french speaking kiruv organisation that you can also find at https://myleava.fr/
ReplyDeleteIn reply to my question to him about when is the date of the geulah the Zohar talks about he cited (also in his lecture) tikunei Zohar page 55a but he asked me not to reveal the date as he is not sure that it will be this year. Also, there may be other options for geulah to arrive either this year or another year. If you'll look by yourself in that Zohar page you will find what it's talking about, the festival of weeks, ie. Shavuot but again, there is no guarantee, this is just one option. We will have to wait and see what happens.
Ron (not Chaya)
It’s very unlikely that Moshiach will not arrive this year. We have way too many simanim and too many big tzaddikim saying it will come this year.
Delete-Leah
Ron, you're forgetting the option for the geula to come today. Rav David Toldedano is organising a big tefilla today/tomorrow, last day of nisan, for the geula. The latter explained at length about Rafah and the ntsostot a little while ago. All the while, saying he hopes the geula would be now.
ReplyDeleteThe geula comes in response to tefilla (Rav Meir Eliyahu gives a whole shiur with sources about this), to zaaka (Rav Zamir, and many other rabbonim), and that even if everything is ready, without tefilla/zaaka there is no geula. In black and white in one of Rav Zamir's books, in the name of Rabeinu Bachya. Pondering future dates is actually counter-productive, as you can't do that and be in a place of zaaka.
I have been following Rav Shaya for quite a while, from well before the war. He has always said he doesn't know for sure, but felt that it is very close. He has never spoken in terms of years. Rav Zis'holtz said that it is this year, and that it was decreed on asara betevet. Last tisha be'av Rav Zis'holtz said that it was the last one. Well before the war.
It is highly problematic, to be constantly thinking about future dates, and not thinking about the geula today. Also as a general comment not about anyone in particular: one can be bekochi uveotzem yadi regarding geula watching, coming up with cleverness in predictions etc, when what Hashem wants from us is to give up any pretensions of control over our lives, and to turn to Him alone.
Ron is not forgetting that option,he's just posting interesting videos and I like hearing what other Rabbonim are saying.
ReplyDeleteYes we know Moshiach can come today or any day, but you also know that some dates are more auspicious than others, and some things have to be accomplished in order that Moshiach is here.
Rafach seems to be a turning point, how long we don't know but we are making progress.
Only Hashem knows if we accomplished everything for Moshiach to come in 10 minutes from now. We have no Navi to tell us that Moshiach can not come until Rafch is over.
Delete-Shira
I’m sorry but anyone who believes that Moshiach can not come “until such and such happens” is going against a foundation of Judaism. There’s a reason all the gedolim of “yesteryear” when we didn’t even have all the signs that Moshiach was arriving b’itoh were as prepared as they can be for Moshiach. The Chofetz Chaim even had a suitcase special to take with him to get to Eretz Yisrael quickly when Moshiach comes.
ReplyDelete-Eliezer
I agree, Eliezer. Not just are they going against a foundation, they are considered Koferim (heretics) according to the Torah.
Delete-Leah
Eliezer, it's like Devorah Chayah mentioned here a couple of days ago.... the Chafetz Chaim etc were in the time when Moshiach could come achisheina [it is hastened], and we are probably in the time where it's b'ito [in it's time].
ReplyDeleteSo maybe we do need dates, I don't know.
It also says somewhere that when Moshiach is coming everyone will know, so I assume that means we know the date in advance, even if it's just the day before. Or maybe it just means everyone will know it's Moshiach.
I think by now everyone realizes that any date that has been given so far has not materialized, and even when we get dates we don't really believe in those dates anymore, maybe it will, or maybe it won't.
But as Gedolim are the ones giving out these dates, then surely it can't be forbidden to do that ??? We're allowed to speculate when we're nearly there.
Those dates are auspicious times for Moshiach. These tzaddikim never said Moshiach can’t come today. Everyone will know before Moshiach because all the signs are here now. And by the way, it’s not even a question if we’re b’itoh or not. Of course, we’re b’itoh. We are overdue for Moshiach with so many proofs.
Delete-Eliezer
According to Netanyahu's book, this particular meeting with the Rebbe that everyone is asking about took place while he was in NY and working at the UN. The Rebbe said he had important things to do there and that he should stay (yes, in America). But Bibi replied that he was returning to Israel.
ReplyDeleteYes that's what I thought. The Rebbe wanted him to stay and continue trying to influence the UN.
ReplyDeleteOh well. Then we have the incredible ruach hakodesh of the great Mekubal who put a mezuzah in Netanyahu’s office over 30 years ago :)
ReplyDelete-Barry
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KvoT1NcpP-I
ReplyDelete1.13.05
Quote: When all the ntsotsot are recovered, Moshiach will be revealed.
That can happen at any moment
Better than that, even if we haven't finished the work, Hashem can finish it, as it happened in Egypt. During the plague of the firstborn, Hashem Himself descended and recovered all the ntsotsot that were missing, and Bnei Yisrael left Egypt at midnight.
The geula can happen at any moment.
It's a process and we are in the thick of it, but at any moment Hashem can decide to interrupt the process, and it depends on our actions. End quote
All of the above are the precise words of Rav David Toledano from a live class on May 6.
Shira, Eliezer and Leah are all absolutely right.
ReplyDeleteAs Rav Toledano says, Hashem can shorten the be'ita process, achisheina betoch be'ita (depending on our actions). Also, it's not just a question of when the geula comes, but how it comes. The problem with the constant future dating is it takes the mind and the heart off of the geula today. For years we've been told that it was going to happen at some future point. That is not zaaka, and it's been done to death. We need to get out of our heads and into our hearts and focus on wanting the geula this very minute.
You have to be careful about taking something from a clip of a rav. When you've been following a rav for a while, you see his style, and what he means when something could be open to interpretation. And how much more so with subtitles, they aren't always accurate.
We don’t even know if Moshiach coming today would be shortening the b’itoh process. Today can be the final end of the b’itoh process. Only Hashem knows. May we welcome Moshiach today!
Delete-Leah
It’s 100% certain that Moshiach is imminent. I can prove it without even mentioning all the signs. This is something most of us know about but forget easily. The Zohar clearly writes that Techiyas Hameisim will start no later than 5790. That means that Moshiach has to come well before then. Also, the Leshem (came after the Zohar) wrote that Techiyas Hameisim will be no later than 5786. And if you put together everything going on in the world now, all the signs of Moshiach fulfilled, and everything Klal Yisrael is going through now, it’s more than obvious Moshiach will be here any moment.
ReplyDelete-Yechiel
The point is what should our individual reaction be to the situation. Someone writes about be'ita, as if that's all there is too it, try to figure out a date, more or less, and hold tight. But that is very clearly not what our sources teach us. If bediavad Moshiach's arrival today is the end of be'itah, so be it. At that point we won't care, yet it doesn't help us before the fact. Nor does Yechiel's assertion regarding until 5786.
ReplyDeleteThe question we should all be asking ourselves is what can I do today to help bring Moshiach now. Which includes talking to Hashem, telling Him why He has to bring the geula now. Nitzchuni banai. Hashem wants us to 'beat' Him, so to speak, with arguments. There is an inyan of being lehitakesh to Hashem, being stubborn before Hashem. Someone said you can't speak to Hashem like that. But that is what Hashem wants from us, especially when we do it on account of the pain in Am Yisrael, and tsar haShechina , so much sheker in the world. Our very name, Yisrael, means to struggle with Gd. We are also, yehudi, to thank Hashem, but the struggle came first.
@anonymnous, I never made an assertion saying that we have to wait until 5786. Please re-read what I wrote! I wrote that’s the deadline for techiyas hameisim (according to the Leshem). Moshiach has to come well before. Any moment now.
Delete-Yechiel
Last anonymous, that makes a lot of sense to me. Thank you.
ReplyDelete